Episode Transcript
[00:00:10] Speaker A: Welcome to another edition of our diocesan podcast, Big City Catholics, with Bishop Robert Brennan, the diocesan bishop of Brooklyn, myself, Father Christopher Henu, here at the co cathedral of St. Joseph. We're so lucky and blessed to have two guests on with us today who are going to join us and talk a little bit about this upcoming world mission Sunday, which the church celebrates on Sunday, October 20. We are gathered with Father Thomas Ahearn from the Diocese of Brooklyn and Father David Costello, who's a priest ministering in the Archdiocese of Boston and a member of the St. James Society there. We'll talk more about that in a moment. We'll begin in prayer, asking our blessed Mother's intercession, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, as we pray. Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
[00:00:56] Speaker B: Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
[00:01:01] Speaker A: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Amen.
[00:01:03] Speaker B: Welcome, Father Hearne and Father Costello. Thank you very, very much for joining in our podcast episode this week of Big City Catholics. It's an exciting time of the year. The month of October is chock full of activity. Certainly the new year has kind of really gained speed. The leaves will begin to turn a little bit later on in the month. And here we have respect life Sunday. We have mission Sunday, and we have some great saints coming in these days of October. So thank you for joining us so we could have a conversation about the missions. On October 20, the church globally celebrates mission Sunday. That's a day for us really to focus in on the missionary work of the church and to remember that we're all called to that missionary spirit to serve as missionaries really close by, but also to be part of the missionary effort. We'll have a chance to talk with Father Hearn about that. I'd like to start with Father David Costello. Father Costello, you were visiting in Brooklyn recently along with a good friend of mine, and we had the chance to talk about your involvement with the St. James Society. I always been fascinated by the St. James Society. I've known a little bit about it through my Boston context, but you're kind of a little more than 60 years strong. Would you like to tell us about the society, the Missionary Society of St. James and the good work that it does?
[00:02:26] Speaker C: Hello, Bishop Brennan. Good to be with you again. Yes. So the Missionary Society of St. James, the apostle, as we're known, it's our full name, was founded by Cardinal Cushing in Boston back in 1958. Essentially, I suppose it was the mission outreach of the archdiocese. But right from the very beginning, the cardinal opened up membership so the priests, like myself, non Bostonians, could also have the opportunity to spend some time on mission. Now, we were founded specifically to work in the southern andean countries of Peru, Ecuador and Bolivia. And the cardinal's idea at the time for founding the St. James is that it was a direct response to an appeal made to the north american bishops by Pope Pius XII when he asked the north american bishops to send some help to the southern continent. In the beginning, there were twelve priests. Eleven from Boston, one from Chicago went down south. The first group went in 1959, and then, I believe, about six months later, the second group went, which was quite a large group, and in that group was Father Tom Daley, who, of course, later became the bishop of Brooklyn. So there was a strong relationship, of course, during all of that time.
[00:03:36] Speaker B: One of the great reasons why the St. James Society, he really does indeed mean something to me. I remember Bishop Daley well and his missionary zeal, so we're proud of his association with the stuff.
[00:03:47] Speaker C: Sure. And I had the good fortune of meeting Bishop Daley for the first time down in Peru. I spent eight years on mission myself in Peru, so I was glad to meet him down there, of course, with his brother, Father Vinnie. Certainly the older members of the society talk very fondly of Bishop Tom. He was known as Big T. I gather he was really instrumental in those earlier years. He was the liaison priest, elected by the priest to talk to Cardinal Cushing back here in Boston and convince him to do whatever it was they were looking to be done down south.
So, yeah, so founded. We're quite unique, I suppose, in that we're diocesan priests, missionaries. So each of us would get permission from our own bishop to join the society, typically for five years. And so we're loaned from our diocese of incarnation to the St. James Society and were assigned to one of those mission countries. Now we have a presence in Peru. We're responsible for, still for three parishes and three different dioceses down there in Peru. I spent eight years myself on mission down there in Peru, so, like everybody else, I had to learn to speak Spanish and undergo some cultural orientation. So I was sent to the Mariannel Language Institute in Cochabamba, Bolivia, six months there learning to speak Spanish. I should mention I didn't speak any Spanish before I joined the society, but I was 32 years of age when I went down there, so they told me I was young enough to pick up the Spanish without any great difficulty. Then I was assigned to Peru, so I spent eight years full time on mission down there in Peru. I was responsible for founding a new parish back in 2006 in the diocese of Chausica, which is on the east side of Lima. That was a great experience, a great personal experience, certainly for me, it certainly enhanced my priesthood. And as I look back in that whole experience, I realized how fortunate I am that I was able to go down there to Lima, Peru, and spend that time there and go through that whole process of really beginning a new parish from zero in Ashanti town on the east side of Lima, in an area of great need where there was no church presence. So I suppose when the cardinals sent out the first group of missionaries, the mandate he gave them was that you're to get in, get on, and get out. In other words, get in and get the parish infrastructure and so forth. Set up work with the people in that parish, and eventually get the parish ready to hand it over to the local diocese and go on and start the process all over again. I gather he told that first group, your job, your main job, is to put yourselves out of a job. In other words, get in, get on, and get out. 66 years later, we're still doing that. We're still fulfilling the cardinal's mandate, and.
[00:06:28] Speaker B: That'S a great mission. You know, we're not trying to create dependent societies. We're trying to get people on their feet, communities on their feet, and it really is very rewarding. I've seen this happen before where in a country you have that missionary approach, but then you develop local vocations. There's an infrastructure. There was an old expression that something along the lines of missionaries go where they're not necessarily wanted, they're needed, and they stay until they're no longer needed, but they're certainly wanted.
[00:06:59] Speaker C: Very, very true. And, yeah, I guess the whole. The whole idea and the whole need for any of us missionaries is not to become so dependent that when we leave, it's a trauma almost for the parishioners. And our whole reason for being there is to help the local church get set up. I suppose we have access to funds from abroad which help us get the parish infrastructure in place, but our purpose is to help that local church, the local diocese, is get parishes set up so that they can bring their own priests in there. Of course, it's not all about the money. Money is important on mission, but it's all about building up the community, the church of God, which is the community, and getting them on a firm setting so that the local diocese the local priests can take over, and that was what the cardinal wanted right from the very beginning.
[00:07:41] Speaker B: That's great. Now, you know, when you talk about the beginnings in Boston, and certainly it seemed like in american society, how did the society find its way to Ireland? And you find your way to society.
[00:07:54] Speaker C: Funny you mentioned that. You know, it was essentially a Boston foundation. But, of course, I often tell people, living in Boston is the next best thing to living at home in Ireland, because there are so many irish here in Boston, and there were so many irish priests, of course, in Boston, as is the case, I'm sure, in New York and Brooklyn and all of these coasts. But back in the sixties, actually, the cardinal, cardinal Cushing, did some recruiting in the seminaries in Ireland. So a number of irish priests were recruited specifically at that time for the St. James Society. The agreement was they would come, they would spend a year, and they were ordained for Boston, they would spend a year in Boston, and then go on down south to one of those three countries while remaining incarnated in Boston. So in my own case, I came to know the St. James's, that he threw an older priest who was from Limerick. We had a connection because Father Jerry's nephew was married to my cousin. So I would meet him each year when he would come home on vacation. So he planted the seed in me. He invited me to come and visit him back in 2003. I did that. I made the decision then that I would go home and ask my bishop for permission to go on mission. My bishop had already put it out there in his communication to the clergy at the time, that he really would be supportive of any of us who might have an interest in going on mission anywhere in the world, be it with the Columbans in Asia or in South America or wherever. So I was fortunate in that I did receive permission from my bishop to go for five years, 20 years on, I'm still with the St. James Society.
[00:09:25] Speaker B: And now I'm serving the society in.
[00:09:27] Speaker C: Boston and serving the society.
I never imagined that I would be living here in the United States. It's amazing how, you know, God works in strange ways. I tell the people here in Boston, I came to Boston via Peru and South America, and so, yeah, but very happy, very fulfilled in this ministry. So, yeah, so there was a lot of irish priests involved with the St. James Society, so that's how I came to hear of it.
[00:09:51] Speaker B: That's great. And Ireland has a great history of missionary work. I mean, all over Africa, All Hallows seminary. You've had a whole seminary devoted to mission activity. And the columbian fathers. Yes, sure, sure.
[00:10:03] Speaker C: And the Columbians, as you know, were founded as the Maynooth Mission to China, Maynooth being the national seminary where I went to seminary over there. So I suppose the natural, I think, for many of us irish priests might be to join the Columbans. But because I had that connection with Father Jerry O'Mara, God rest him, that's how I heard it's the St. James Society. I visited with them back in 2003 and made that decision. And here I am 20 years later as the director of the St. James Society, which is something I never could have imagined.
[00:10:30] Speaker B: It's just great. You know, when I was visiting with Father Paul Crosby, a mutual friend of ours in County Meath, and we visited the columbian fathers, there was a little bit of the history of some of the great missionaries, and one of them has Brooklyn associations. In fact, outside the chapel in Douglaston, there's a plaque. I want to say Bishop Gavin, who was a columbian father but had those Brooklyn connections, and we remember him here at home. So we're thrilled to have the intertwining of Brooklyn and so many missionary efforts. And that brings me then to you, Father Ahearn. Father Thomas Ahearn is pastor of Our lady of Perpetual Help in Richmond Hill, Richmond Hill, South Ozone park, but serving that general area. And I asked him about a year and a half, maybe two years ago, to take on the work of the mission from Father Keeney, who did a wonderful, wonderful job with it. And you yourself have done that. And we're really very grateful for the hard work that you do, both in the parish and in the missions. Tell me about your own love for the missions.
[00:11:34] Speaker D: Before I begin, I just want to comment about Bishop Daly, because as a seminarian and then as a young priest, a number of times, Bishop Daly would talk about his experience with the St. James society. And he always said those years were some of the happiest years, not only his priesthood, of his life. He just loved being down there. And, I don't know, I think he went horseback riding. I mean, he had to use a horse. Am I correct, Father Castle?
[00:11:59] Speaker C: That's correct.
[00:12:00] Speaker D: Yeah, he kind of. I mean, he. He would inspire people to be interested in the missions because of his love of the work. He made it exciting and sounded wonderful. And he was a big champion of the St. James.
[00:12:13] Speaker B: He was. And, you know, I would get the impression that in his later years serving in the diocese of Brooklyn, he had that desire that when he retired, he would love to go back into the missions. His help really didn't allow for that when he became of retirement age. And he served our diocese well, yet you could see he had that missionary spirit in his blood also.
[00:12:34] Speaker D: I'm sure you learned it as well. Quechua.
[00:12:37] Speaker C: That's correct, yeah.
[00:12:38] Speaker D: Yeah. That's another language, kind of a native.
[00:12:40] Speaker C: Language, the indigenous language, which is spoken more in the mountains, where Bishop Daley would have worked as a.
[00:12:45] Speaker D: That's right. Up in the mountains, camping out.
[00:12:48] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah.
[00:12:49] Speaker B: And Father Costello, speaking of Bishop Daly, you had mentioned to me that he was kind of influential in some of the structure that really made things more efficient in this society, including leadership from within, right?
[00:13:03] Speaker C: That's correct. Yeah. So in the early days, the leader of the St. James, that he was the director of the mission office, like Father Tom, but, of course, in the case of the first two directors, they hadn't actually worked in South America, so they weren't overly familiar with what was going on down there, and they weren't familiar with the climate and with the.
[00:13:20] Speaker B: Culture and so forth, the practical needs. Yeah.
[00:13:22] Speaker C: Yeah. So the priests decided that they needed one of their own to be the leader, to be up here in Boston and understand what was going on down south. So Tom Daley, Bishop Daley, later Bishop Daley, was instrumental in coming up here to Boston to speak with Cardinal Cushing. And it was Bishop Daly who convinced Cardinal Cushing to allow the St. James society elect its own leader. That was, like, back in the 1960s, which was a great decision, because then they had somebody up here who totally understood the needs in each of those different areas because, you know, the needs in the mountains of Peru, for example, are so different, even to the needs on the coast of Peru. You have two totally different climates, and I don't know if any of you have been to these mission countries or to the mountains, but they're just so vast and so different. And I look at some of the photographs, the older photographs, I see Bishop Daly and so many of those with his horse and with his volkswagen beetle and all those guys got around. And then, you know, they, coming from the city of Boston, these guys somehow learned how to ride horses in the mountains of Peru. And I guess they all became mechanics as well, because they were all able to fix their own cars. Some of them would tell me about coming back here to the United States and ordering parts for their cars and bringing the parts for their cars back with them when you had no problem getting through customs with, you know, gear parts for a gearbox or a clutch and so forth. But it's amazing how those priests learned all of these things alongside doing their parish work and their mission work and so forth.
[00:14:53] Speaker B: After all that experience, he comes back to serve in the diocese of Palm beach and in Brooklyn. I didn't think. I don't think he had much writing for us around here.
[00:15:01] Speaker C: Yeah, he probably could have had his own shop there in Douglaston, fixing.
[00:15:08] Speaker B: So, Father Ahearn, you were pretty inspired by Bishop Daly's missionary service.
[00:15:12] Speaker D: Yes. And it ties in with what the office of the propagation of the faith, the mission office does with our missionary cooperative program, which is. We have missionaries come in, usually during the summer months, to each parish to raise funds, but also they have a priest or a sister or Layperson telling the folks in each parish about a particular place and a particular mission. And I have to say that people of Brooklyn are very receptive. They're interested. They like hearing about what's going on in other parts of the world with the church. I think they're enlightened in many cases, because in the sense that there are many places now, maybe more than before, I'm not sure, but many places now where being person of faith is put your life in danger. Some of these places are physically, the missionaries are in danger. Even the catholic people are in danger of being persecuted. I'm hearing stories, and that's one of the blessings of the office, because we meet with so many missionaries one on one in the office. And really, it's an eye opener to hear what they really. What they go through and what their people go through. And not to emphasize the negative only, but the positive is the church is growing in so many places. Not just growing, bursting at the seams. They can't keep up in parts of Africa with the number of people attending mass. Nigeria, Kenya are two countries in Africa that have the highest mass attendance in the world. Percentage wise, I think it's like 80% in Nigeria, more than that, even in Kenya, for the Catholic. Now, not everyone in these countries is catholic, but the catholic population is very active and growing. But then there are many smaller places. We have a very special relationship with the people of Haiti. In the diocese of Brooklyn, we have many, many haitian parishioners and a number of haitian priests working here. And as everyone knows, Haiti is going through a terrible crisis once again. They've had earthquakes, they've had political turmoil, and just a lot of violence in addition to poverty, you know, extreme hunger, food insecurity, lack of medical care, et cetera, et cetera. So we try to really make a special effort with some of the folks that are directly connected with the diocese of Brooklyn and Bishop Brennan. And before Bishop Brennan, Bishop Dimarzio have made very special efforts in reaching out to the haitian people. As one example, there are others, but that's one example that stands out. But the World mission Sunday is very important. I never knew until I was in the office that the World mission Sunday collection is actually mandated. In the code of canon law, we have many special second collections, but most of them are not mandated. This is how important the Holy Father sees it. Helping. It's over 1100 mission territories in the world that are being helped by the World Mission Sunday collection. And what always impresses me is that when I speak to the missionaries that, you know, in the places where we're helping in their parishes, they have the World Mission Sunday collection. And the philosophy is, you know, to give is to receive a blessing. And their answer is, we want to receive blessings, too. We want to be able to give. We don't have much to give at all. In fact, we receive a lot of help, but we want to be able to give as well. So I think that's a real. That's very inspiring, because you have. And when we speak to the missionaries, they and their people are very, very anxious to pray for all of us as we pray for them. I know when the individual missionary goes to a particular parish, their assigned parish, already there's prayer for that missionary and for the work of the mission and vice versa. The missionary is praying for the people of that parish, and the missionaries are very grateful to have the opportunity. Unfortunately, what we do, we have, I think, over 180 parishes that can host a missionary. But because of the size of some of the parishes, not all, but some of them, we have to give multiple parishes to one missionary. So each missionary would get three, maybe even four, just to have a nice little collection to bring back. Because some of the parishes here, because of the, you know, the demographics, things we're discussing all the time, they're only able to give a small amount themselves. Nevertheless, every parish hears about the missions. Every parish is praying for the missions and learning more about our church and how important it is to have that kind of missionary spirit. So that's one of the major. We get many applications, I'm sure the archdiocese, we have so many. So many we have to turn down.
[00:20:05] Speaker B: It's sad. I mean, we wish we could do everything for everybody, right?
[00:20:09] Speaker D: It's impossible. Yeah. It's overwhelming when you hear the needs and the. But World Mission Sunday helps these 1100 territories in different ways. They're helping build churches they're helping build schools. They're training priests and novices. I think it's right now that 38,000 or 40,000 seminarians are being supported by World Mission Sunday collections, in addition to the St. Peter Apostle Society, which is specifically for the training of priests and seminarians. But that's just one example of so many things that are helping these communities. You know, I'm kind of, like, empowering them, as you said, to, you know, get in, get on and leave. They're helping them really establish these structures so that they can continue the building of the church. It's very exciting for them, too. They come in very excited about their church growth, and it's amazing to me. I work with one particular friend of mine, is a missionary at a catholic university in Nigeria. And to hear literally hundreds of students coming for Sunday mass, but also for daily mass at six in the morning, they're coming. So there's a real desire for the Eucharist and a desire to be close to our lord. So it's wonderful to hear these stories. That's why I'm so glad they can share these stories with the people of our parishes.
[00:21:32] Speaker B: When I was in the diocese of Arkansas, had a relationship with a diocese in the Dominican Republic, the diocese of San Juan de la Muguana. And we would send priests, and the sisters of St. Joseph sent sisters. We covered two parishes, really, a parish, meaning a city, a small city, El Cicado, and the other one being Andovalle. But those cities then would serve campos like, there'd be chapels, hundreds, chapels all over. And so, you know, the priest would be in the city on the weekend, would celebrate mass, but in some of these compost, they would only have mass once a month or so. It came to a point where some of the vocations started to develop. In fact, one of the homegrown vocations is our vice chancellor, Father Hermias, in transfiguration. So we're not sending as many priests down anymore, although they gave the opportunity for priests like myself just to experience it. And seminarians, I know a lot of seminarians would go just to experience it. And it is such an eye opening experience to see how the church is so very alive in different parts of the world and yet even admit, maybe because of great need, and then to see again that turn around. You mentioned some of the countries in Africa, like Nigeria. Well, you know, now Nigeria and Ghana, they're sending priests to help us. Now we need missionaries. By the David, you mentioned Peru.
We don't have many Peruvians here. We do have a lot of Ecuadorians here in the diocese, but the Peruvians we have are still strong in that culture. The month of October, they're celebrating Senor delos Milagros all month long. I'll go back to Long beach. We had a community in Long beach. I'll go back there at the end of the month. Last year, I was over in St. Sebastian's, and they have the big procession. So again, those local cultures from mission countries, actually, as people come here, they become part of our local culture. And so the culture of Brooklyn and queens is so rich, so alive because of the gifts of so many people by the hand. You'd experience some of that yourself, right? The richness of the cultures?
[00:23:41] Speaker A: Absolutely. I mean, here in the diocese, as we know, is such immigrant nature of our diocese, but also, like in my own experience in mission work with Marinol, taking summers to go to parts of Asia and South America, it's just an eye opening experience. I think Father Hearn speaks to this, too, that when we continue to grow in our multimedia nature, like when we can share the message on small videos, I mean, years ago, this, it was sort of a mysterious kind of thing. Where is this money going? Where, what are we actually helping now? There's great videos, there's great social media awareness of what's happening, and I think that also definitely helps. You know, you can follow the missionary, you can follow their order, you can follow the local church or the local diocese and see where these projects are being built.
[00:24:30] Speaker B: When I was a kid, we used to get, my mother used to get marital magazine. That was really our awareness of missionary work, but it was also, we would use it to cut out pictures for reports and for posters projects. But it was really an eye opening experience, and I think that's one of the key things. You brought this out, Father Hearn. It's not just about money. And again, our people are so generous when it comes to the missions, but it really is that sense of solidarity. And those reports back. You know, the missionaries, and a lot of missionaries from Brooklyn, Queens, are serving in other lands, other territories, and we've had missionary martyrs who've come. Some of the sisters have roots here in Brooklyn and Queens, martyrs in Latin America, but they're doing the work that we're interested in doing, but we certainly can't do it ourselves, but we can be part of it. And that's, I think, one of the blessings that the Lord gives us, that we're all part of it, not just throwing money in the basket, but through our prayers, through our concern. The people who are missionaries are our arms and legs out in the field.
[00:25:35] Speaker D: In connection with Father Chris's comment as well, because we have so many priests from Nigeria, Ghana, other parts of Africa, Asia and South America. I mean, they bring, they don't. It's not just mission Sunday where they share their experience. The parish really gets to know very often about the particular place their parish priest is from. And they learn so much. I mean, when I speak to parishioners now, I mean, I remember years ago we had a director of the propagation of the faith was a wonderful priest, Monsignor Jim Aesop.
[00:26:11] Speaker B: Oh, I remember him.
[00:26:13] Speaker D: He was a real champion of the missions. That was the only connection we heard from. We never had priests from Africa when I was growing up anyway. It was just american. So when he came, everyone was riveted to hear some of the stories. But now, because of media, television and personal experience, we know so much more about some of these places. The average parishioner knows much more about some of these mission territories, maybe just one or two territory, but they get the idea, hey, people are struggling. This is the propagation of the faith. And the Pontifical Mission society help the growing church or the struggling church in other parts of the world. It's powerful.
[00:26:53] Speaker C: I think it's important to say, too, that we don't have to leave our native country, our home, to be missionaries. I often tell priests, some of my own priest friends would say, I could never do what you're doing. But I remind them, you don't have to do what I'm doing. You know, you can be a missionary at home. I think of St. Therese of Lisieux, the patroness of the missions. She never got to leave her convent in France because her health was so bad. And yet she became the patroness of the missions. And Bishop you mentioned, there's so many feast days in October. I think of the north american martyrs and so many like them, you know, so we don't have to leave our home to be a missionary, and we can support the missionary with our prayers, of course, in so many other ways as well. But I think it's really important to just remind ourselves all of us are missionaries by virtue of our baptism. And Pope Francis, in his message for mission Sunday this year, the message is to go out and invite all to the banquet. I think it's a beautiful image to open the doors of the church. He keeps telling us we have to go out and invite people in. We're not to remain in the sacristy and hope that the people are going to come into us. When I started my own mission parish down there in Peru, I was confronted by some people who were part of my community, shall we say, who couldn't understand why I was having other people come and benefit from our home, our feeding program for children and so forth. And I kept saying, but, but our whole purpose for being here is to invite other people in, especially the people who maybe aren't yet part of our community.
[00:28:19] Speaker B: So how do you.
Absolutely. Well, I thank the two of you for your work, and we pray in a very particular way for the missionaries who are out there doing that, going out into the field. We had a great, great conversation here. I'm going to close asking the Lord's blessing. May the Lord bless you and keep you. In the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Amen.
[00:28:43] Speaker A: Thank you, bishop. Thank you, Father Costello and Father Hearn, for your presence here today. And we remind our faithful that world mission Sunday coming up, October 20. Sunday, October 20 we thank you for your generosity, but most importantly, we thank you for your prayerful support. God bless you and we'll see you again next week.
